Comeback Mechanics

Lord Thane

Nolio I really like this idea, not only will it help rebuild beaten down/smaller kingdoms, but also make it easier for players joining an existing round to more easily catch up in the ranks.

Nolio

Lord Thane That's ultimately the goal. And I want people to point out its flaws so it can be tweaked to work as intended. Productive discourse for the benefit of the game

Lord Thane

Nolio this one seems that it will take a lot more discussion to make usable. In it's current state, it would be pretty easy to abuse by sending a small army at a friend to give them protection. I think I saw some people talking about a scale of "if you lose % of your army defending then you get protection", that could be something that works for this idea (it prevents abuse by allies sending a small force to give protection, while fulfilling the idea of getting a successful defender time to rebuild).

Nolio

Lord Thane Yes it would require a % of army killed, you're absolutely correct. I meant to add that in. I think like 20% sounds reasonable, but that number would need to be tested

skigglez

Nolio
Defending getting protection is a great idea. One issue i see with the X percent military dying requirement - is that percent of total military or what’s left at home? If you full send and leave a single troop at home how would that work? I think there would be ways to abuse it for sure, but maybe someone else can think of a way around that.

Along those same lines, I thought about a short term boost to defense after being TS’d as a way to level the playing field for those who don’t have dedicated casters in their playing group. It makes sense too - the kingdom knows that others are looking at them and would be on high alert. Not sure what type of bonus would be appropriate, maybe higher defense or reduced losses for a couple of ticks?

While on the topic of TS, my group has been consistently TS’d by super low KS kingdoms (less than half our size) that seem like they’re just there to TS for the larger group. Would it make sense to limit how high up you can successfully cast an offensive spell, or the higher the target is there’s a scaling failure chance?

Nolio

skigglez To answer the first question, it would be of your total army. So if you sent out 90%, then you get no defense protection. It would stop exactly what you are referring to with the abuse.

As for TS, that's a cool idea! I'm not sure how it would work, but I'll give it thought for sure.

And as for how high up you are, I'm not sure. I can see reasons both for and against it. Against it being that you're worried multis might be used to get info. If we live in a fantasy world (pun intended) where there are no multis, then I don't think there should be a limit. Maybe slightly more difficult and scaling like you mentioned. But reason for it is if a bigger kingdom wants to pay a small one to do a TS for them, I think that should be allowed.

Lord Thane Oh lawd, I can see the future threads about DDP being the worst,
lol

Lord Thane

skigglez good point about the garrison. It could be abused in a niche situation, like if they suicide and lost and didn't want to face pre-re (because they lost, so no CLI), then they might leave 1 troop to handle the % thing... It complicates how we'd code such a feature, but it's not impossible. We could calc total defense points of all units in garrison and away armies to figure if they met the threshold for Defender Defense Protection (we'd use defense points as a better measure of overall army strength, to account for races that have high # fodder).

Oh lawd, I can see the future threads about DDP being the worst, I will have mobs with pitchforks out to get me again 😭

skigglez

Nolio
Yeah the spell stuff could be addressed through future tech changes maybe. Having a magic defense tree would be interesting - final tech could be something like “block one incoming offensive spell every 24 hours”. Not sure on the coding side, but techs might be better ways to address some of these things

Lord Thane

skigglez magic resistance tech is actually really good. That's the kind of ideas the new tech system will need.

trupheus

Lord Thane magic resistance tech is actually really good. That's the kind of ideas the new tech system will need.

Will there be a tech to balance the scales or are we just saying sorry to the people (me) that want to try to EQ a person to the ground using legitimate means?

LOOKIN AT YOU SMURFS. LOOKIN AT YOU. 🙂 <3

trupheus

Nolio I also believe that if you successfully defend, you should get a short protection period. Something along the lines of 6 - 8 hours.

Wouldn’t this make it harder to bring down big KS kingdoms?

I’m not sure who right now could break Lear in 1 hit. Let’s say his full army his home. He gets hit and gains 3 hours of prot. That’s 3 hours for him to find a pre against a kingdom that just sac’d their entire army against him. Maybe the failed attacker gets put in prot by someone else. Pick the situation, the failed attacker obviously has minimal army home. Lear takes the retal and wins. Now Lear has CLI to rebuild. Never broken.

Nolio

trupheus It actually should not make it harder because

If Lear loses 20% or more of his army, he wouldn't be able to rebuild that much in time. Let's say he loses 50%, in 6-8 hours he realistically should only be able to rebuild about 25% unless he has a stockpile. Which if he does, then it will take another break to get him. He shouldn't be punished for being first.

Second thing is, if someone hits him and only kills 15%, then he has a new total army and is still open to attacks. Another 15% and he's still open but has lost just under 30% of his army and is about to lose more to an oncoming attack.

The goal is to find a balance where he can rebuild more than he lost if he loses the minimum 20% and gets protection. But can't rebuild it all if he loses like 70%

Lord Thane

trupheus that's a really good point! I don't know off the top of my head how this idea could be balanced to not give large kingdoms such a big advantage, definitely don't want to do that 🤔

Lord Thane

trupheus yeah I was just thinking we would have to put an equivalent tech tree. I'm not quite sure how the counter balance to the magic resistance tech would be. We could of course cheap out and put an opposing "magic effectiveness" tech, but I think something more creative would be better, maybe some tech that improves wizard rest rate so they can get more attempts at casting or something like that.

trupheus

Nolio

Interesting idea, I do like the idea of helping smaller kingdoms get in the mix. I don’t see how it’s going to enable a kingdom to hit someone 3x their size when they probably have a military much smaller, its going to help them catch up but not boost their military.

Totally unrelated. Can we please speed techs up. Or give us a building (schools?) that speeds up tech time?

Sinnywinks

Lord Thane speaking of bigger kingdoms have a large advantage how about making the retal rights last longer than the [protection time for the attackers in CLI. At this point there's no reason or incentive for smaller kingdoms to build a castle or grow. I'm not sure why no one is seeing this problem.

Cora

Lord Thane yes, please!!!

Lord Thane

Sinnywinks that would defeat the purpose of CLI, which is to prevent pre-re. What we are considering is putting a cap on CLI protection so it doesn't work if attacking kingdoms smaller than 70% KS, to help ease bottom feeding activity and give smaller kingdoms the pre-re opportunity if they are bottom fed.

Wine

Lord Thane Hello, is it normal that all troops at home were wipeout in just one attack of enemy?

I thought there would be certain percentage of troops left alive right? Sorry for my English not good. 💁

Lord Thane

Wine it is possible to lose 100% if you only have 1 castle.

If you have 2 castle, then you can only lose 80%.

If you have more castles, the defenders fighting scales down to 70%.

If you have many castles, and 1 medical center per land, then the max troops you can lose on defense is 50%.